What rubbish to say secular thought came from Paul! Long before their Jesus philosophers in the Hellenistic period laid the foundations for secularism and humanism. These ideologies did not start with Christianity but predate it by more than 300 years. Typical theological garbage.
It is a very insightful discussion given by the speakers… for the message of the gospel is not to constrain people into religion, but free them from religious and secular restraints… not to form people into a dogmatic institution, but to free people to be like children again; innocent, not seeing division or judging by color of skin or by background, but simply being at peace with one another. The faith of Christ Paul explained was one that absorbs all religions, all cultures and all peoples ( just like it absorbed the Roman Empire ). It is a faith that turns things from the inside out, not the outside in.
You can't always tell who is a Christian or who has their heart set on following the essence of Christ ( love your enemy / love everyone / be at peace with everyone ), but you can sometimes tell who is of any particular religion… and this too is what the message shall absorb.
I think that Mona Siddiqui is being inconsistent. If the Qur'an is the word of God then it is surely appropriate to believe every word of it but Mona wants to read the Qur'an through the lens of liberalism and to pick and chose on that basis. That's an absurd position to adopt. If its merely a human document then it cannot have the force that muslims want to give to it.
My thoughts at running time 6:00 when Augustus is quoted as summarizing Paul's teaching "laugh and do as you want."
There is a freedom, but not to indulge the depravity witnessed around the world… and this is spoken of in volumes throughout Paul's writings. Not to be a religious robot memorizing and repeating rule after rule, but being conscience ( what the speaker mentions just prior to the six minute mark ) of your words and actions as they affect others.
The debate is fascinating. Tom Holland despite not being a Christian (or atleast not in a conventional sense – I'm not sure of his beliefs) clearly has a great degree of affection for the faith. He did a truly grand job outlining the differences between Islam and Christianity particularly thedialectic nature at the heart of the writings of Paul.
Its interesting as there exists a strong argument for secularism and societal liberalism having a strong association and origins in Christianity however this isn't really the case with Islam.
What rubbish to say secular thought came from Paul! Long before their Jesus philosophers in the Hellenistic period laid the foundations for secularism and humanism. These ideologies did not start with Christianity but predate it by more than 300 years. Typical theological garbage.
Tom Holland is such an engaging historian.
It is a very insightful discussion given by the speakers… for the message of the gospel is not to constrain people into religion, but free them from religious and secular restraints… not to form people into a dogmatic institution, but to free people to be like children again; innocent, not seeing division or judging by color of skin or by background, but simply being at peace with one another. The faith of Christ Paul explained was one that absorbs all religions, all cultures and all peoples ( just like it absorbed the Roman Empire ). It is a faith that turns things from the inside out, not the outside in.
You can't always tell who is a Christian or who has their heart set on following the essence of Christ ( love your enemy / love everyone / be at peace with everyone ), but you can sometimes tell who is of any particular religion… and this too is what the message shall absorb.
I think that Mona Siddiqui is being inconsistent. If the Qur'an is the word of God then it is surely appropriate to believe every word of it but Mona wants to read the Qur'an through the lens of liberalism and to pick and chose on that basis. That's an absurd position to adopt. If its merely a human document then it cannot have the force that muslims want to give to it.
Amazed by the quality of the discussion ! Nothing like this could happen in France (pity !!)
Wonderful discussion.
My thoughts at running time 6:00 when Augustus is quoted as summarizing Paul's teaching "laugh and do as you want."
There is a freedom, but not to indulge the depravity witnessed around the world… and this is spoken of in volumes throughout Paul's writings. Not to be a religious robot memorizing and repeating rule after rule, but being conscience ( what the speaker mentions just prior to the six minute mark ) of your words and actions as they affect others.
The debate is fascinating. Tom Holland despite not being a Christian (or atleast not in a conventional sense – I'm not sure of his beliefs) clearly has a great degree of affection for the faith. He did a truly grand job outlining the differences between Islam and Christianity particularly thedialectic nature at the heart of the writings of Paul.
Its interesting as there exists a strong argument for secularism and societal liberalism having a strong association and origins in Christianity however this isn't really the case with Islam.